Character Planning

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Camlen's familiar gets a feat at 6th level. I'm pretty much at a loss as to what he should get; any good ideas?

Obtain familiar.

[PhaedrusXY]

Camlen's familiar gets a feat at 6th level. I'm pretty much at a loss as to what he should get; any good ideas?

Dark Stalker. Hidden Talent. Bind Vestige. Martial Study.

[Chemus]

Camlen's familiar gets a feat at 6th level. I'm pretty much at a loss as to what he should get; any good ideas?

Obtain familiar.

Heh. Too bad he doesn't have an arcane caster level or three. That would be fun(ny)!

Dark Stalker. Hidden Talent. Bind Vestige. Martial Study.

Of course. I am shamed. Good ideas!

Thanks guys!
Edit: Hidden Talent: Conceal thoughts?

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Camlen's familiar gets a feat at 6th level. I'm pretty much at a loss as to what he should get; any good ideas?

Obtain familiar.

Heh. Too bad he doesn't have an arcane caster level or three. That would be fun(ny)!

Magical training, my friend.  Magical training.

You get a feat for level three, right?


Wait a sec... you have spellcaster level 7.  IF you picked planar familiar instead of improved, you could have a mephit.

[VennDygrem]

Shape Soulmeld could also be incredibly useful, and doesn't have any requirements. Your familiar can't really take Bind Vestige since he's incapable of performing the rituals involved in summoning and binding said vestige, and vestiges aren't going to want to bind with most non-humanoid creatures anyway. Hidden Talent could work, but would likely be of limited use [though I'd have to specifically waive the prerequisite of taking it only at level 1]. Shape Soulmeld, on the other hand, lasts all day.

@TML: Actually, familiars and psicrystals in this campaign will only gain a feat for every 6 character levels of the owner, rather than one at every 3 levels that PCs get.
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I'm in the mood to steal creative ideas from other sources.

I'm hoping that just about everyone is taking a custom artifact. These aren't like normal artifacts, as they give you powers/abilities based on inner spirit. Beyond the abilities I've already spoken with you all about, you can use a free action to summon a special weapon, which is a manifestation of your spirit. They function as a +1 weapon of a sort which your character is proficient in. This can be enchanted as a normal weapon of its sort can. You call the weapon with a command word, and can store it with another command word (as though sending it to an extradimensional space). If you'd rather, you can instead choose for this to be a shield made of magical energy granting that same enhancement bonus to AC as a shield bonus, and with no ACP. Basically, I don't want casters to feel left out by having to be stuck with a weapon they're unlikely to use. You could also choose for it to still appear as a weapon, but grant the shield bonus, though it gains no enhancement bonus to attacks made with it. In this case, it is just the same shield but in a different visual form.

You all decide what this looks like, and it would be great if you all came up with a name for said item. It should be a reflection of your inner self, so if you're a defensive melee tank, perhaps it manifests as a broad longsword named Iron Mountain; a sneaky character might manifest a dark-hued rapier named Ebon Stalker; A caster/manifester might manifest a shield in a shape like the Triforce called Third-Eye Shield, simply a quarterstaff, dagger, gauntlet, or what-have-you that they use to deflect attacks; etc.
Just as your artifacts' powers grow over time, so will your weapon/shield.

Perhaps it seems stupid, but I like the idea. 

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Do they get a first level feat as well, or not.

Because I just thought of how awesome a spellfire-spewing familiar would be.

[Chemus]

Shape soulmeld! Grawr! (Edit: damn! Req. Con 13)

Also, I don't think customizing creature's feats is allowed by core; you get the critter as in the description, adjusted by the familiar abilities, unless given special dispensation by the DM ( :bigeyes)

[VennDygrem]

Again, no first level feat. They get one at 6, 12, and 18. That's it. Everything else is as normal for a familiar or psicrystal (remember, this was done to clear up confusion over whether psicrystals get feats or not from being constructs).

Also, see my last post for edited content.
----edit----

Shape soulmeld! Grawr! (Edit: damn! Req. Con 13)

Really? Damn, forgot about that. Oh well. :/

[Thistledown Thurbertaut]

Aw crap!

Seeing as how I was reminded of Initiator levels, I went back and checked on my maneuvers.  MOst of them I get at Swordsage 1, but it gets really confusing since maneuvers have both prerequisites in terms of maneuvers known and IL....sigh...it doesn't help either the way WOTC lists them all in Alphabetical order rather than "level"....it took me forever to figure out the naeuvers I wanted...and now I can't take them unless I postpose swordsage ALO...the thing is I am very specific aboput which maneuvers I want and retraining just sounds dumb to me.  In order to take a Level 5 power at SS 1, I need 16 levels from other classes to have an IL of 9 with SS1. Seeing as how I want SS 2 am dealing with a bought off LA of 3, that just won't work period.  Looks like I am limited to Level 4 maneuvers in this build requiring 12 class levels before SS1.  That would put me at an ECL of 16 including the xp lost for the buyoff at CL 12....pretty late in the game.

Okay let's limit myself to a max of L3 for maneuvers.  That gets more reasonable, needing *only* 8 class levels before SS1 and an ECL of 13 (pre buyoff).

Being able to use Savage Species here would *really* help in terms of level since the racial levels could theoretically add to IL.  As is my build will have to look something more like this:

Fighter 2, Battle Dancer 1, Rogue 1/Swashbuckler 3, Rogue 1, Swordsage 2, Rogue and SB levels to taste.

That's about as good as I can manage without racial levels and still get the maneuvers I want with SS1.

I am fine with it but someone suggested that a Pixie Fighter 2, Battle Dancer 1 would be next to useless in this group.  I am inclined to disagree given some handy creative SLA's not to mention magic arrows, but if you guys have any better suggestions for progression I am open to it.

[Chemus]

...you can use a free action to summon a special weapon, which is a manifestation of your spirit. They function as a +1 weapon of a sort which your character is proficient in. This can be enchanted as a normal weapon of its sort can. You call the weapon with a command word, and can store it with another command word (as though sending it to an extradimensional space). If you'd rather, you can instead choose for this to be a shield made of magical energy granting that same enhancement bonus to AC as a shield bonus, and with no ACP. Basically, I don't want casters to feel left out by having to be stuck with a weapon they're unlikely to use. You could also choose for it to still appear as a weapon, but grant the shield bonus, though it gains no enhancement bonus to attacks made with it. In this case, it is just the same shield but in a different visual form.

You all decide what this looks like, and it would be great if you all came up with a name for said item. It should be a reflection of your inner self, so if you're a defensive melee tank, perhaps it manifests as a broad longsword named Iron Mountain; a sneaky character might manifest a dark-hued rapier named Ebon Stalker; A caster/manifester might manifest a shield in a shape like the Triforce called Third-Eye Shield, simply a quarterstaff, dagger, gauntlet, or what-have-you that they use to deflect attacks; etc.
Just as your artifacts' powers grow over time, so will your weapon/shield...

That adjustment just saved me 1620 GP on my Car Insurance! WBL! I might be able to afford...something-or-other!

[VennDygrem]

Aw crap!

Seeing as how I was reminded of Initiator levels, I went back and checked on my maneuvers.  MOst of them I get at Swordsage 1, but it gets really confusing since maneuvers have both prerequisites in terms of maneuvers known and IL....sigh...it doesn't help either the way WOTC lists them all in Alphabetical order rather than "level"....it took me forever to figure out the naeuvers I wanted...and now I can't take them unless I postpose swordsage ALO...the thing is I am very specific aboput which maneuvers I want and retraining just sounds dumb to me.  In order to take a Level 5 power at SS 1, I need 16 levels from other classes to have an IL of 9 with SS1. Seeing as how I want SS 2 am dealing with a bought off LA of 3, that just won't work period.  Looks like I am limited to Level 4 maneuvers in this build requiring 12 class levels before SS1.  That would put me at an ECL of 16 including the xp lost for the buyoff at CL 12....pretty late in the game.

Okay let's limit myself to a max of L3 for maneuvers.  That gets more reasonable, needing *only* 8 class levels before SS1 and an ECL of 13 (pre buyoff).

Being able to use Savage Species here would *really* help in terms of level since the racial levels could theoretically add to IL.  As is my build will have to look something more like this:

Fighter 2, Battle Dancer 1, Rogue 1/Swashbuckler 3, Rogue 1, Swordsage 2, Rogue and SB levels to taste.

That's about as good as I can manage without racial levels and still get the maneuvers I want with SS1.

I am fine with it but someone suggested that a Pixie Fighter 2, Battle Dancer 1 would be next to useless in this group.  I am inclined to disagree given some handy creative SLA's not to mention magic arrows, but if you guys have any better suggestions for progression I am open to it.

You don't automatically get those arrows in an unlimited supply. I think one of the books might give a value for them, though.
Just look at 'Pixies as Characters' - the arrows aren't listed as a feature there. It's specific equipment that some pixies have.

Go ahead and take the SS Pixie levels, I don't care anymore.

[Thistledown Thurbertaut]

Re: Arrows.  Ah...I just know the SS gives you the ability to make them.  I can't imagine they cost alot though...since Fey in the woods don't really use currency the way humans do.  I would think they just craft the arrows and enchant them and supposedly the abilty grants them the ability to make them as if they had all the prereqs.

Go ahead and take the SS Pixie levels, I don't care anymore.

You don't really mean that do you?  It's hard to tell with just text but I detect a faint hinto of exhaustion or DM burnout from all of our crazy requests.  Don't get me wrong, counting the LA as levels adds to my IL, technically allows for me to use Otto's Dance, gives me more starting skill points, and all of that is great but I don't want you to feel badgered into it.  I wasn't trying to pester you, only trying to wrap my brain around the limitations of the build and prereqs.  If you really do mean it then the only real update for 3.5 is the addition of Damage Reduction 10/Cold Iron.  It also means I only get two class levels to play with at the start instead of 3 which would probably go to fighter.

Would I still get to "buyofff" a level at level 16 level 15? (Note that with SS, we are effectively averageing out an LA of +5 and since 3x5=15) Also, since Pixies are born with wings would you allow me to take Flyby attack etc. as one of mky fighter bonus feats?


Thank you for your DM benevolence.

[Thistledown Thurbertaut]

If all of the above is fair game we have a progression that looks more like this:

Pixie 5, Fighter 2, Battle Dancer 1, Swordsage 2, Rogue 1, SB 3, (hypothetical buyoff point), Rogue 1, Cleric 1(?),  Daring Outlaw combo for the rest…

Lets me get the Swordsage goodness at a lower level to equalize the power levels and saves the gratuitous levels of Sneak Attacking for later levels.

[VennDygrem]

It's not really exhaustion. There's just no real reason not to go with it. I don't want you getting squashed just because you only have 20 hit points while everyone else has 50 (or so). You still won't have a very high BAB, which is going to hurt, and your saves are likely to be relatively low. Fey HD aren't really all that good.

Again, you can easily make a good character that matches the flavor you're going for with a more general swordsage base. You could even adapt it to be based off of Cha more than Wis, if need be. Still, you've had plenty of help with your character too so I wouldn't want to undo all that work.

As for the arrows, you're still going to need to craft them. That takes time regardless of cost. Speaking of cost, the flavor of whether pixies use currency or whatever is irrelevant. Cost is relative value, rather than strictly literal.

A sleep arrow costs 107 gp in market cost, or if my estimates are correct (and they may well not be), about 53.5 gp and 4 xp per arrow crafted.

Memory loss costs 607 gp market cost, or estimated 303.5 gp and 24 xp per arrow crafted.

That's pretty pricey for ammunition, if you plan on using them regularly. You've got plenty of better tricks up your sleeves without needing to worry about pixies' magic arrows. You've left that world behind, even if only partially.

As for the Damage Reduction, treat it as giving DR 2/cold iron per progression level.

[Thistledown Thurbertaut]

Sounds good.  And yes pricey for ammo (unless the arrows are recoverable).  Still not a bad idea to keep a couple arround just in case, memory loss in particular can be devious.

Regarding hit points.  It is unorthidox but I had one DM who was concerned about the low fey HD consider giving me 1d6 for each of the 5 fey levels  rather than a single HD for all 5.

Would that be broken?  I'm not terribly attached to it but it might help survivability (also I don't know how brutal you are planning on being with us...)

[Flay Crimsonwind]

I'm in the mood to steal creative ideas from other sources.

I'm hoping that just about everyone is taking a custom artifact. These aren't like normal artifacts, as they give you powers/abilities based on inner spirit.

The writer in me AND the gamer in me love you for these kinda things Venn! I totally get to delve into the inner spirit of a (what some might consider) amoral bloodsucking aristocratic sorcerer who binds the darkness and spirits to his will! And make something cool out of it!

[VennDygrem]

Sounds good.  And yes pricey for ammo (unless the arrows are recoverable).  Still not a bad idea to keep a couple arround just in case, memory loss in particular can be devious.

Regarding hit points.  It is unorthidox but I had one DM who was concerned about the low fey HD consider giving me 1d6 for each of the 5 fey levels  rather than a single HD for all 5.

Would that be broken?  I'm not terribly attached to it but it might help survivability (also I don't know how brutal you are planning on being with us...)

Technically Pixie characters are supposed to trade their 1HD of Fey for their first class level, but there's hardly any point in going with the progression if all it ends up being is the LA spread out into a table. You might as well count it as d6 hp for each of those levels.

[VennDygrem]

I'm in the mood to steal creative ideas from other sources.

I'm hoping that just about everyone is taking a custom artifact. These aren't like normal artifacts, as they give you powers/abilities based on inner spirit.

The writer in me AND the gamer in me love you for these kinda things Venn! I totally get to delve into the inner spirit of a (what some might consider) amoral bloodsucking aristocratic sorcerer who binds the darkness and spirits to his will! And make something cool out of it!

I hope what I'm stealing the concept from isn't too blatant.

[Thistledown Thurbertaut]

Sweet!  

:Hugs Venn:

[VennDygrem]

Hey, it seems like the least I can do since you get no BAB or saves. At least you get a ton of ability boosts and SLAs and other abilities, or there would really be no reason to take it over a LA 0 race and martial adept or caster levels.