http://brilliantgameologists.com
May 23, 2013, 11:37:07 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: These boards are now READ ONLY. We've started over! So don't try posting here. Go here www.minmaxboards.com
 
   Home   Help Search Members Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 »
  Print  
Author Topic: Telthor: Low-level incorporeality (updated with a handy guide!)  (Read 4014 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Negative Zero
Grape ape
*****
Posts: 1532

combarishnigm7@yahoo.com Combarishnigm0
Email
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2009, 07:25:07 PM »

Might I suggest that you find an oak tree, designate a spot under its canopy as the place you are tied to, and then cast acorn of far travel on it?

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040710a
Logged
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2009, 08:22:19 PM »

I don't have access to U-E, so no comment on that.

Savage Species gave Incorporeal an LA of +2, and you could get an expensive Ritual to just add it, as an acquired template.
XPH / SRD has the little used PrC that gives Incorporeal in exchange for losing 4 "Caster" Levels ... bad ... but not far off the SS template.
Wish can do the SS ritual.
PAO once or twice can certainly give it, with the downside of possibly being dispelled. This is the cheapest and easiest route.

There was a very longwinded argument for taking limited levels, of the SS racial classes;
but I can't find it, and the board big shot didn't weigh in to support it.
If so, a Shadow less than full, is Incorporeal at level 1, with it's racial class.
You are also Undead, and turnable.

I don't usually discuss houserules, but I give a Commoner 1 with Incorporeal, as a 1st level racial class,
and don't bother with the LA buy-off. Close enough to be kinda RAI, but not strictly RAW.

As you mentioned, the Savage Species ritual is rather expensive. Unless the PC is using infinite wealth shenanigans, 306k gold is a good chunk of cash, even for a level 20 character. It's also not a template, exactly, despite adding the incorporeal subtype and adding +2 level adjustment.

Psion Uncarnates do certainly get incorporeality, but it's their capstone ability. Which means that without early entry, the soonest they'll get it is ECL 15. With the best early entry, the soonest they could get it is at ECL 11.

As long as you're using the rules for a transformative Wish, it looks like a great option; at 28,825gp, a scroll of wish is available earlier than the previous two transformation methods. Even if the optional "chance to gain abilities" variant is in effect, the incorporeal subtype isn't one of the things you'd have to roll for. (Skill checks are easy to boost, too.)

Polymorph Any Object is a very nice spell, but it costs money. To a lesser extent than Wish or the Ritual of Transfiguration, but with the additional downside of being dispellable. If you get hit by a dispel, and bought those two scrolls of PAO as soon as you could, you probably just lost half your WBL.

Incorporeal commoners being a fun idea aside, I'm not convinced that it's possible to take partial monster classes. (With certain very specific exceptions.)

Necropolitans can arguably turn into incorporeals (Shadows mainly) via Alter Self + Metamorphic Transfer. Necropolitan Psion1/Wiz5 with Practiced Manifester and Metamorphic Transfer could do it. The main limitation is needing Manifester level 5 to take Metamorphic Transfer, so there might be ways to cheese that in earlier.

I've given this a brief bit of thought, since I made this post in the simple questions thread. Here's what I came up with...

Either
  • "Your creature type and subtype (if any) remain the same regardless of your new form." prevents you from gaining the incorporeal subtype. Using Alter Self to transform into an incorporeal creature will have some weird effects. (Turning into a corporeal version of that creature, I guess?)
or
  • "You acquire the physical qualities of the new form while retaining your own mind" and "any gross physical qualities" are more specific than the prohibition against changing subtypes. Therefore, using Alter Self to turn into an incorporeal creature grants incorporeality.

I, for one, subscribe to the latter. It would be a good question to ask a DM before a game, and actually a useful one if you're a Telthor. If the second of my above list is true, I believe a Telthor spellcaster could Alter Self into a corporeal fey, pick up his gear, and dismiss the Alter Self, conveniently making all of his gear incorporeal without need of the Ghostly Grasp feat.

I agree with Midnight V, I doubt a DM would allow DR to prevent the damage from the telthor being out of his home area.  You aren't reducing physical damage via tough skin, etc.  If I were DMing this character (which is an awesome concept, BTW), I would require fast healing to deal with it; Damage Reduction wouldn't prevent it.

Quick ways to get fast healing:

Half-troll template (Fiend Folio)
Nature's Warrior 1 (Comp Warrior)
Warshaper 4 (Comp Warrior)
The Tainted Raver template (Heroes of Horror)

Well, I was about to say "Hey DR works for this by RAW". It doesn't.

Quote from: SRD: Damage Reduction
The creature takes normal damage from energy attacks (even nonmagical ones), spells, spell-like abilities, and supernatural abilities.
Bound to the Land is a supernatural ability.

Therefore, either Fast Healing, or some way to remove the Bound to the Land ability is needed. As noted in the original post, Dustform Creature + Incarnate Construct does this, though it may also have some undesirable qualities (reduced dex, bonus to a nonability, lose all other SA/SQ). More ways to do this would be appreciated, though I'll start looking through books again, and revise the OP a bit when I get back home.

Feral also works, assuming you apply it before Telthor and Theltor can be applied to Monstrous Humanoids...

Telthor is Humanoid or Animal only.

Might I suggest that you find an oak tree, designate a spot under its canopy as the place you are tied to, and then cast acorn of far travel on it?

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040710a

Despite its limited duration, Acorn of Far Travel has some other neat tricks associated with it. (Hathran, I'm looking at you.)

Thanks for the input, everyone.
Logged
ksbsnowowl
Grape ape
*****
Posts: 1645


Wishing I was a raging Norseman


« Reply #22 on: January 18, 2009, 09:54:49 PM »

Other ways to get fast healing:

Half Vampire Template: +3 LA, fast healing 1 up until you reach half hit points. (Libris Mortis)
Dragon Shaman 1: one of the auras will grant you (and allies in range) fast healing 1 up to half hit points. (PHBII)

Maybe pair either of those with the Barbarian alternate class feature from PHBII so that you will slowly go into a Rage as you are away from your tied area.  Just a thought.

Vivacious Creature: +5 LA, fast healing 5, can be applied to humanoids and fey. Type becomes outsider. (Planar Handbook)
Shadow Creature: with 4 HD can have fast healing 2.  I don't have the Manual of the Planes update handy to check the LA.
Saint: Become a Saint after becoming a Telthor.  +2 LA.  Gains fast healing equal to half hit dice. (Book of Exalted Deeds)
Corrupted Creature:  Book of Vile Darkness.  Fast healing equal to half HD, IIRC.  No listed LA, however.
Dry Lich: PrC from Sandstorm.  Fast Healing 2 in arid environments.
Logged

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

KSB Snow Owl's Archer Build thread
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2009, 01:57:30 AM »

Other ways to get fast healing:

Half Vampire Template: +3 LA, fast healing 1 up until you reach half hit points. (Libris Mortis)
Dragon Shaman 1: one of the auras will grant you (and allies in range) fast healing 1 up to half hit points. (PHBII)

Maybe pair either of those with the Barbarian alternate class feature from PHBII so that you will slowly go into a Rage as you are away from your tied area.  Just a thought.

Vivacious Creature: +5 LA, fast healing 5, can be applied to humanoids and fey. Type becomes outsider. (Planar Handbook)
Shadow Creature: with 4 HD can have fast healing 2.  I don't have the Manual of the Planes update handy to check the LA.
Saint: Become a Saint after becoming a Telthor.  +2 LA.  Gains fast healing equal to half hit dice. (Book of Exalted Deeds)
Corrupted Creature:  Book of Vile Darkness.  Fast healing equal to half HD, IIRC.  No listed LA, however.
Dry Lich: PrC from Sandstorm.  Fast Healing 2 in arid environments.


For what it's worth, Vivacious creatures are incorporeal anyway -- so a Vivacious Telthor would be pointless.

So I found something that could help with the supernatural ability. It's in... Serpent Kingdoms.

Ability Rip.

This spell is awful. It takes 1 hour to cast, and has a 1 hour/level duration.

The recipient gets a supernatural ability temporarily (if I'm reading this right) and permanently loses a supernatural ability or two hit dice. What the hell? Horrible trade. Get a (Su) ability for at most about 3 days with CL pumping and Extend Spell, takes an hour to cast, and permanently lose a (Su) ability.

Fortunately, the bolded text is exactly what we want. So, buy a 2,275gp scroll (and find a way to use it), and you don't have to worry about that ability anymore.

I had high hopes for Trait Removal, but it's temporary. Manipulate Form could totally do it, but I'm not even going to touch that (with a standard-issue 11 foot pole).

According to the "spellcasting service" pricing guideline, Ability Rip should cost 910gp to get at minimum caster level. It also has fun flavor, visiting a wizard so he can perform an arcane ritual that removes your magical bond to your homeland.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2009, 02:23:13 AM by Emy » Logged
PhaedrusXY
Organ Grinder
*****
Posts: 8022


Advanced Spambot


« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2009, 03:31:55 AM »

 Laugh That's brilliant. I guess a vampire could lose his vulnerabilities to sunlight and the like by using this, also. Hilarious.
Logged

A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2009, 04:14:33 AM »

Maybe pair either of those with the Barbarian alternate class feature from PHBII so that you will slowly go into a Rage as you are away from your tied area.  Just a thought.

I was going to suggest Dragonmark Rage which gives fast healing while raging, but the feat specifically doesn't work while under the effects of a rage spell or any other effect that emulates the rage or frenzy class feature.

Laugh That's brilliant. I guess a vampire could lose his vulnerabilities to sunlight and the like by using this, also. Hilarious.

The target is "two living creatures" so he'd need to become a living creature for the spell. I don't know if he'd need to be a living creature for the entire 1 hour casting time or if he could turn into one for the few minutes at the begging or the end.
Logged
Negative Zero
Grape ape
*****
Posts: 1532

combarishnigm7@yahoo.com Combarishnigm0
Email
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2009, 04:17:51 AM »

I haven't read Telthor, but is he not alive? The type is undead, not Fey, so I don't see why he wouldn't be alive just because he's incorporeal.
Logged
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2009, 04:25:57 AM »

I haven't read Telthor, but is he not alive? The type is undead, not Fey, so I don't see why he wouldn't be alive just because he's incorporeal.

Sorry, to clarify (also edited for SPAELING):

Laugh That's brilliant. I guess a vampire could lose his vulnerabilities to sunlight and the like by using this, also. Hilarious.

The target is "two living creatures" so the vampire would need to become a living creature for the spell. I don't know if he'd need to be a living creature for the entire 1 hour casting time or if he could turn into one for the few minutes at the beginning or the end.
Logged
BowenSilverclaw
Organ Grinder
*****
Posts: 5337


Walking that fine line between genius and insanity


Email
« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2009, 06:50:19 AM »

Damnit, I was just about to post about Ability Rip

Logged

"Weakness? Come test thy mettle against me, hairless ape, and we shall know who is weak!"

Quote from: J0lt
You caught a fish.  It was awesome.  
Midnight_v
Organ Grinder
*****
Posts: 2660


Dulce et decorum est pro alea mori.


« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2009, 08:48:17 AM »

Quote
Maybe pair either of those with the Barbarian alternate class feature from PHBII so that you will slowly go into a Rage as you are away from your tied area.  Just a thought.

Quote
I was going to suggest Dragonmark Rage which gives fast healing while raging, but the feat specifically doesn't work while under the effects of a rage spell or any other effect that emulates the rage or frenzy class feature.
Twitch
Wait no, I think that still counts as rage.
from phb2
Quote
Any effect that would normally apply only during your rage applies only when your berserker strength is active.
So berserker strength + Dragonmark rage should work.
I would also make the argument that berserker strength qualifies for rage feats.
Best of all your rage will almost always be in effect...
Though frankly I can' think of a level in which you want to walk around with so few hp...
better to take that natures warrior level...

Logged

\\\"Disentegrate.\\\" \\\"Gust of wind.\\\" \\\"Now Can we PLEASE resume saving the world?\\\"
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2009, 10:44:13 AM »

Telthor Minihandbook

Introduction
Telthor is a template from the Unapproachable East supplement for Forgotten Realms. It gives a few minor benefits, changes the base creature's type to fey, and adds the incorporeal subtype. It has level adjustment +2. I focus mostly on low levels in this guide, due to the Telthor's low level adjustment relative to other incorporeal templates. Also, the specific character I wanted to build (which I hope to use in a game some time) has only a couple class levels at most. In short, a ghostly character can be playable as early as ECL3.

As always, any input (related even vaguely) is quite appreciated.

Contents
post 0
Introduction
Contents
post 1
1. Incorporeality
2. Attacks
3. Dealing With Items
4. Bound to the Land
5. Cat In A Box (Questionable Rules)
post 2
6. Sources
7. Sample Builds
8. Other means of becoming incorporeal
« Last Edit: January 31, 2009, 05:45:37 PM by Emy » Logged
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #31 on: January 19, 2009, 10:44:25 AM »

1. Incorporeality
Incorporeality is, by and large, an advantage. At low levels, not many enemies have the means to harm you. You can also bypass just about any physical obstacles, and detect invisible enemies if they happen to be next to you. Incidentally, you also have Charisma as a deflection bonus to AC, and no Strength score. Dex is used for melee attacks. Incorporeal creatures are also sneakier than most; they always move silently unless they wish to be heard, and certain detection methods such as scent or blindsight don't always work against them.

2. Attacks
Normally, incorporeal creatures have limited means of attacking corporeal foes. Most incorporeal monsters, for example, have an ability damaging or draining incorporeal touch. While Telthor get no such special draining attack, their attacks are modified.

If the base creature did not use weapons, what happens is simple: the base creature's melee attacks become incorporeal touch attacks.

If the base creature did use weapons, it's a little weirder. Here's what happens:
  • The base creature's melee attacks become incorporeal touch attacks, as with a non-weapon using creature.
  • The base creature can attack with its melee weapons as melee touch attacks. Note the lack of the word incorporeal here. Incorporeal touch attacks and touch attacks are not the same thing; the latter is superior. The first sentence of the attacks section should still apply, so a Telthor using weapons makes its weapon attacks as both melee touch attacks and incorporeal touch attacks.
  • The base creature loses its ranged attacks. So if the base creature could spit venom or similar becoming a Telthor, it loses those. (See the cat in a box section. Maybe.)

3. Dealing With Items
Telthor are incorporeal. This means they can't normally manipulate or benefit from items. They don't have a ghost's telekinesis ability or anything similar either. This is bad. Fortunately, there are some ways to compensate.

First, the Monster Manual 3 update to the incorporeal subtype added some very important text as far as the (usually heavily item dependent) player character is concerned.
Quote from: Monster Manual 3: incorporeal subtype, paragraph 3, sentence 1
Any equipment worn or carried by an incorporeal creature is also incorporeal as long as it remains in the creature's possession.

Vow of Poverty
If you want to ignore the existence of various items, take Vow of Poverty and pretend they don't exist. Thankfully, this is not the only option. While Vow of Poverty is quite fitting for some characters, it's quite limiting in alignment and roleplay (must be exalted). You also can't choose the bonuses you get from it.

Ghostly Grasp
This wonderful feat from Libris Mortis gives incorporeal characters of at least Charisma 15 the ability to manipulate and use corporeal items as if they were corporeal. Yay.

My Friend, The Wizard
If you have a friendly spellcaster that doesn't mind using a 3rd level spell slot for Permeable Form every once in a while, you can probably get by without another means of item handling. When they cast the spell, they become incorporeal for a round. This also makes their items incorporeal. So they fill a cheap sack with the stuff they want to give you, cast the spell, and hand it over. Once it's in your possession, it stays incorporeal until you drop it.

Alter Self
Maybe. See the Cat In A Box section.

Ectoplasm and other temporary items.
Ectoplasm. Equipment can be made out of it, which is usable by ghosts and other incorporeals. Unfortunately, it degrades over time. There are also some other items, such as Ectoplasmic Ichor can also allow incorporeal creatures to manipulate physical objects. As temporary solutions, I can't honestly recommend them.

4. Bound to the Land
Here is the disadvantage of being Telthor. Bound to the Land is a supernatural ability that deals the Telthor 1 damage per minute whenever they're outside of a certain 1-mile radius. Since the theoretical Telthor I'm discussing here is a player character, this damage is most likely constant. Fortunately, much like the difficulty inherent in item use, this can be overcome.

Get Rid Of It
  • The Ability Rip spell is normally horrible. You get a supernatural ability for 1 hour/level, and in exchange you permanently lose a supernatural ability. Fortunately, losing a supernatural ability is exactly what we want to do here. A scroll of it is 2,275 gp. According to the "spellcasting service" guidelines, it should cost 910gp (minimum CL) to 1400gp (CL 20) to have cast on you by an NPC Wizard.
  • If you have a way of getting a persistent antimagic field, you could have that active at all times, suppressing your supernatural abilities. An incorporeal creature in an AMF also sounds really tough. What are throw going to do, cast spells at you?
  • Becoming a Dragonborn will remove most of your racial abilities; this includes Bound to the Land.
  • Applying the Dustform Creature template followed by the Incarnate Construct template nets you +0 LA, -2 dex, the loss of all your SA/SQ, and a type change to humanoid. This gets rid of Bound to the Land quite handily, but is probably overkill.
  • Assuming you can count as a Scaled One somehow, manipulate form could get rid of Bound to the Land for you. This is definitely overkill.

Heal The Damage
  • Dragon Shaman 1 can have a Fast Healing aura. I hope you like being at half HP all the time, though.
  • Troll-blooded, a Dragon magazine feat, gives Regeneration 1. The fatigue in sunlight is a bit lame, but is easily justifiable for a ghostly character. Also, regeneration is way better than fast healing.
  • A Walker in the Waste turns into a Dry Lich at ECL15. Dry Lich is a +5 LA template that gives (among other things) Fast Healing. I believe that this and the other templates that give Fast Healing raise the Telthor's level adjustment more than I'd like.
  • See Surreal's Lists of Stuff for more methods of gaining Fast Healing.

Special Mention
The Acorn of Far Travel web spell makes you count as being under a target oak tree for 1 day/level. Since as a Telthor you're probably a native of Rashemen anyway, (if you're using the fluff as-written, that is) there's no reason not to go into the Hathran prestige class.

5. Cat In A Box (Questionable Rules)
It's entirely possible that these things listed both work and don't work until observed (by your DM).

Attacks
While I interpreted the attacks section above as best I could, your DM might think "loses all ranged attacks." means something completely different, from the moderately reasonable "loses ranged proficiencies" to the utterly absurd "can never use a ranged weapon again, cannot cast spells other than touch/personal."

Alter Self
What happens when you Alter Self into a corporeal creature as a Telthor, or from a corporeal creature to an incorporeal creature? Alter Self doesn't specify, and while Polymorph states that it cannot cause the subject to become incorporeal, and that incorporeal creatures are immune, the inhertance clauses in the Polymorph chain do not work backwards. Here are two interpretations of the rules regarding Alter Self and incorporeality.

Because of this guide's subject, the following text assumes it's an incorporeal creature attempting to use Alter Self to become a corporeal creature. However, it is equally applicable to a corporeal spellcaster attempting to become incorporeal via Alter Self. Either:

  • (1) "Your creature type and subtype (if any) remain the same regardless of your new form." prevents you from gaining/losing the incorporeal subtype. Using Alter Self to transform into a corporeal creature will have some weird effects, perhaps effectively turning you into an incorporeal version of that creature.
or
  • (2) "You acquire the physical qualities of the new form while retaining your own mind" and "any gross physical qualities" are more specific than the prohibition against changing subtypes. Therefore, using Alter Self to turn into a corporeal creature grants corporeality.

I, for one, believe it is the latter. Asking which applies in your game is a useful question to ask your DM before a game, if you have a Telthor character that can or will be able to cast Alter Self.

Either of these interpretations can benefit a Telthor, though in different ways. If it's (2), it can be used to aquire, manipulate, and use items by transforming into a corporeal creature, picking up the items you need, and dismissing the Alter Self. If it's (1), Alter Self can be used with Assume Supernatural Ability to gain things like Greater Invisibility (plus the incorporeal's ability to be perfectly silent, and not show up on blindsight/similar), or a Sirine's Intelligence Damage (pretend you're an Allip).

Mindsight
It's is a great feat. It's entirely possible a DM will let Telthor Telepathy qualify you for Mindsight. So if you're interested in being a radar dish, ask about this.

Zzz
Do Telthor really need to sleep? I mean, by RAW I think they do... but they don't have bodies or anything.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2009, 05:45:56 PM by Emy » Logged
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #32 on: January 19, 2009, 10:44:45 AM »

6. Sources

updated incorporeal subtype, Monster Manual 3 glossary
incorporeal section of "running undead encounters", Libris Mortis pg 140 - specifically states that incorporeal creatures don't have to eat, drink, or breathe. this was actually a concern of mine since Telthor are Fey and not Undead

Ability Rip, Serpent Kingdoms
Acorn of Far Travel, http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040710a
Dragon Shaman, Player's Handbook II
Dragonborn, Races of the Dragon
Dry Lich, Sandstorm
Dustform Creature, Sandstorm
Ectoplasmic Ichor, Libris Mortis
Incarnate Construct, Savage Species
Intelligence Damage / Sirine, Monster Manual II
Manipulate Form, Serpent Kingdoms (this is the ability used to create Pun-pun. If you seriously haven't heard of it, google is your friend.)
Mindsight, Lords of Madness
Permeable Form, Lords of Madness
Surreal's Lists of Stuff AKA the Surrealodex, http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2546.0
Telthor template, Unapproachable East pg 75
Troll-blooded feat, Dragon 319
Vigor, Lesser, Complete Divine
Vow of Poverty, Book of Exalted Deeds

7. Sample builds
The only one I've really put much thought into is the Dread Necromancer. More/better builds would be appreciated.

ECL 3 Dread Necromancer
Magic-Blooded Lesser Aasimar Telthor Dread Necromancer
Type: Fey (Extraplanar, Incorporeal, Augmented Humanoid), Level 1 (+2 LA, ECL 3)
Feats: Tomb-tainted Soul, (flaw)Ghostly Grasp, Trait: Spellgifted (Necromancy)
Hopefully the Aasimar energy resistances will help her not die very early on. Can hit things with either a greatsword or a combo of Charnel Touch + Chill Touch.

ECL 4 Iaijutsu Dude
Star Elf Telthor Marshal 1/Fighter 1
Type Fey (Extraplanar, Incorporeal, Augmented Humanoid, Elf), Level 2 (+2 LA, ECL 4)
Feats: Aereni Focus (Iaijutsu Focus), (flaw)Ghostly Grasp, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Gnome Quickrazor)
Let's mix campaign settings! I'm sure there's some better way to do bonus damage, but hey, Iaijutsu Focus works alright. Just needs a way to get people flat-footed.

ECL 5 DFI Bard without flaws
Silverbrow Human Bard 3
Type Fey (Dragonblood, Incorporeal, Human, Augmented Humanoid), Level 3 (+2 LA, ECL 5)
Feats: Dragonfire Inspiration, Ghostly Grasp, Song of the Heart
Another attempt at getting bonus damage. The flawed version works better of course, due to Ghostly Grasp taking a valuable feat slot.

ECL 5 DFI Bard
Silverbrow Human Bard 3
Type Fey (Dragonblood, Incorporeal, Human, Augmented Humanoid), Level 3 (+2 LA, ECL 5)
Feats: Dragonfire Inspiration, Ghostly Grasp, (flaw)Two-weapon Fighting, (flaw)Extra Music, Song of the Heart
It's like the previous one, except better.

8. Other means of becoming incorporeal
Classes:
Psion Uncarnate

Templates:
Ghost (LA +5)
Ghost Brute (LA +5)
Ghostly Dragon (LA +5)
Spectral Creature (LA +7)
Umbral Creature (LA +5)
Unbodied (LA +4)
Vivacious Creature (LA +5)
Wraith (LA +7)

Savage Species Transformation Rituals:
Ritual of Transfiguration (+2 LA, 306k gold, 12,240 exp)
Wish

Spells (all are temporary, all are persistable)
Eladrin Form - Book of Exalted Deeds (Sor/wiz 7)
Ghostform - Libris Mortis/Spell Compendium/Complete Arcane (Sor/wiz 8)
Permeable Form - Lords of Madness (Sor/wiz 3)
« Last Edit: January 30, 2009, 09:47:16 PM by Emy » Logged
awaken DM golem
Organ Grinder
*****
Posts: 3294


PAO'd my Avatar


« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2009, 03:59:43 PM »

Bowen - Yeah I agree (but)
Neg Zero - I forgot that one. Yeah get an acquirable template, to take 1 level of, and "finish" the template class sometime later ... like 40th level.
That was that trick.

The one I was thinking about is gone, and I don't recall the details.


PhaeXY has another good idea.
Erudite Spell to Power can get Alter Self + MT feat going at 5th level, with the Necropolitan / Shadow stuff.


If it could be figured what the 2 level racial class would be to just add Incorporeal, then it's even easier.

Lastly,
Outsiders with 4HD and Cha of 13, can shuck their form and possess stuff; also in SS.
I forget the details. I don't remember how the LA +2 suddenly get chunked on.


And good stuff Emy.
Logged
Emy
Bi-Curious George
****
Posts: 489


« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2009, 07:17:56 PM »

Added another section, "Other means of becoming incorporeal" and added some sample builds I threw together.

Bowen - Yeah I agree (but)
Neg Zero - I forgot that one. Yeah get an acquirable template, to take 1 level of, and "finish" the template class sometime later ... like 40th level.
That was that trick.

The one I was thinking about is gone, and I don't recall the details.


PhaeXY has another good idea.
Erudite Spell to Power can get Alter Self + MT feat going at 5th level, with the Necropolitan / Shadow stuff.


If it could be figured what the 2 level racial class would be to just add Incorporeal, then it's even easier.

Lastly,
Outsiders with 4HD and Cha of 13, can shuck their form and possess stuff; also in SS.
I forget the details. I don't remember how the LA +2 suddenly get chunked on.


And good stuff Emy.


The outsiders with at least 4HD and Cha of 13 that have the ability to possess stuff don't have that ability simply by virtue of having 4HD, Cha 13, and Outsider type. It's only "some fiends" with at least 4 hit dice etc. It also says that this ability adds +2 CR. I'm not sure where you got +2 LA from.

(I'm looking at Eberron Campaign Setting. If the info you saw was somewhere else, lemme know.)
Logged
jameswilliamogle
Hong Kong
****
Posts: 1279


Email
« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2009, 07:49:41 PM »

Adding another concept...

Any character that can bind Malphus (whether through Binding levels or the Bind Vestige + Improved Binding feat) could use Malphus's Bird's Eye Viewing to target enemies while stuck in a wall using the bird then strike them using a ghost touch weapon.  Which is fairly awesome.
Logged

ksbsnowowl
Grape ape
*****
Posts: 1645


Wishing I was a raging Norseman


« Reply #36 on: January 21, 2009, 01:26:16 PM »

Found another source of fast healing, though it doesn't help with the low-ECL goal for the telthor.

Draconimicon, page 70:

Fast Healing [EPIC]
You heal your wounds very quickly.
  Prerequisite: Con 25
  Benefit: You gain fast healing 3, our your existing fast healing improves by 3. The benefit of this feat does not stack with fast healing granted by magic items or nonpermanent magical effects.
  Special: This feat may be taken multiple times.  Its effects stack.
Logged

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

KSB Snow Owl's Archer Build thread
The_Mad_Linguist
Organ Grinder
*****
Posts: 8780


Simulated Thing


« Reply #37 on: January 22, 2009, 03:01:35 AM »

As for healing...

there's always the old standby of carrying around a magic trap of cure light wounds, triggered by touch.

Or five spell turrets, if you're a little less cheesy.
If they're each on a CLW/Bless/Sanctuary/Summon Monster I cycle, and staggered so each spell is being cast each round, you shouldn't have any trouble.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2009, 03:04:52 AM by The_Mad_Linguist » Logged

Linguist, Mad, Unique, none of these things am I
My custom class: The Priest of the Unseen Host
Planetouched Handbook
Want to improve your character?  Then die.
Negative Zero
Grape ape
*****
Posts: 1532

combarishnigm7@yahoo.com Combarishnigm0
Email
« Reply #38 on: January 22, 2009, 02:33:27 PM »

You only take the damage once a minute. You hardly need to heal damage every round.
Logged
BowenSilverclaw
Organ Grinder
*****
Posts: 5337


Walking that fine line between genius and insanity


Email
« Reply #39 on: January 22, 2009, 03:01:16 PM »

It doesn't hurt though

Logged

"Weakness? Come test thy mettle against me, hairless ape, and we shall know who is weak!"

Quote from: J0lt
You caught a fish.  It was awesome.  
Pages: « 1 2 3 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!