Land Based Terminal Velocity for added damage to melee attacks in DnD?

[Eviltedzies]

Ok I KNOW this topic has been hammered several times in the past. Most people like to talk about how to find nifty ways to add that lovely falling damage to their attacks. Sadly there is no rule in DnD as to how long it takes an object or creature to fall a given distance. It is assumed that an entire fall occurs within the 6 seconds of the round.

The average terminal velocity for a medium sized human in a random position in real life is roughly 115-125 mph. This limit can be increased to 215mph roughly when using the bullet position. So I tried some simple calculations to see how fast in DnD terms a creature would have to be able to move on land to achieve said speeds.

Average Terminal Velocity: 125 mph (1,100ft/6seconds)

Base Speed: 1,100ft (Without major cheese this kind of base speed is just not possible)

Charge Speed: 550 (x2 = 1,100) (Barbarians using the alternative Ferocity varient can charge x4 their movement I believe. Otherwise this speed is still difficult to achieve)

Run Speed: 275 (x4 = 1,100) (Even a level 20 monk with haste can still only reach base speeds up to 120ft.)

Run Speed with the Run Feat: 220 (x5 = 1,100) (See above. Even if one could achieve the speed with the Run option you would need to run for at least 1 full round prior to the round you attack in AND it would all have to be in a straight line. O_o)

As we can see it is very difficult to achieve such speeds without some major hijinks or running in a straight line for an uncomfortably exposing period of time. Assuming you could somehow reach such breakneck speeds how would you calculate your damage? What if you didn't want or have the room to run the full distance and needed to calculate damage? The best assumption I could make was to divine 1,100ft by 20. This represents the 20d6 damage a falling object or creature gains after attaining terminal velocity. (Basically when falling damage stops calculating due to no more acceleration)

Feet Moved in 1 Round/ Added 1d6
55ft   / +1d6
110ft   / +2d6
165ft   / +3d6
220ft   / +4d6
275ft   / +5d6
330ft   / +6d6
385ft   / +7d6
440ft   / +8d6
495ft   / +9d6
550ft   / +10d6
605ft   / +11d6
660ft   / +12d6
715ft   / +13d6
770ft   / +14d6
825ft   / +15d6
880ft   / +16d6
935ft   /+17d6
990ft   /+18d6
1045ft   / +19d6
1100ft   / +20d6

Does anything I've just said make any reasonable sense? And before you say I haven't taken into account air resistance or mass or some other actual physics equation let me say that I am trying to simplify the speed+damage rules for dnd purposes. I don't want to use some complex formula to find out my damage. Oh and don't forget that all this added damage is also done to you or the weapon your holding when/if you actually hit your target.

Any comments, queries, or complaints feel free to post. I honestly just want some input on a reasonable way to apply the speed mechanic to Dnd for purposes of added damage.

[EjoThims]

This really should be on the houserule forum, as that is what it is.

[jojolagger]

Sadly there is no rule in DnD as to how long it takes an object or creature to fall a given distance. It is assumed that an entire fall occurs within the 6 seconds of the round.

I beg to differ.

Minimum Forward Speed: If a flying creature fails to maintain its minimum forward speed, it must land at the end of its movement. If it is too high above the ground to land, it falls straight down, descending 150 feet in the first round of falling. If this distance brings it to the ground, it takes falling damage. If the fall doesn’t bring the creature to the ground, it must spend its next turn recovering from the stall. It must succeed on a DC 20 Reflex save to recover. Otherwise it falls another 300 feet. If it hits the ground, it takes falling damage. Otherwise, it has another chance to recover on its next turn.

Not for all falls by RAW, but but it is a rule for how fast things fall.

[Kormoran]

I think, aside being homeruling, there's an error.
Cynetic Energy (I'm sorry I do not remember english terms for sure) progress with square of speed... thus, doubling speed means energy x4... thus x4 damage.
Granted your value 1100 ft and 20d6 damage, @ speed 550 ft the damage should be 5d6.

Moreover, remeber that both the charger and the target will get the "falling damage"...

If you think... jumping by 5 ft is nothing... by 10 ft, without training is a bit dangerous, but not so much... by 20 ft you surely will be injured and may be risk death... by 40 ft,... you're dead, usually.

[Agita]

Well, falling already works differently from Real Life in D&D. Might as well not even pretend to use real Physics if you're going to houserule this.

[Bauglir]

Also, there's no reason to assume damage is directly proportional to kinetic energy. For instance, some quick research suggests that a musketball might have had about 809 ft/s muzzle velocity (which, for the sake of simplicity, let us assume is not subject to air resistance). The DMG's Renaissance weapons suggests that a musket ball would weigh .2 pounds; converting that to mass and then all the units to metric, (246.5 m/s)^2*.0907 kg = 5111 J. Now, a dagger weighs 5 times as much, and deals a bit less than 2/5 as much damage, on average. Thus, were damage a direct product of kinetic energy, we would expect a dagger to have 2044.4 J of energy, and thus a velocity of root(2044.4/.453) m/s, or 67.18 m/s; further research suggests that thrown knives move at around 14 m/s. I don't think that any reasonable margin of error accounts for this difference.

[Eviltedzies]

If nobody has noticed there is a discrepency with the DMg's rules for firearm damage and the DMG's rules for falling damage.

Why is something moving faster than a falling object at maximum terminal velocity doing only a fraction of the damage?
The falling object is dealing its damage based on the distance traveled + weight yes. But the distance traveled is merely a way to represent how fast it was able to accelerate to before it impacted.

So for simplicities sake I think they simplified the rules to take out physics.

That being said..... common sense says if something hits you going 100X miles an hour your going to feel something.

Oh and I was aware that both the faller and the target would take damage. Thats what DR & Fast Healing is for rofl.

[skydragonknight]

Extended High CL Footsteps of the Divine (Complete Champion). It's rnd/level and you can end it early to get +10 ft per round of duration you give up. So at a CL of 50 and extended, it's 100 rounds = +1000 ft/round. On a Cleric/Barbarian (Champion of Gwyn-whatever?) with the Barbarian Ferocity variant, you would only need a CL of 26 +Extend to get +520 ft (enough for 550), which is achievable via minimal cheese with the right consumable magic items (Bead of Karma, and I think there's another from MIC that make this simple enough).

[jojolagger]

Extended High CL Footsteps of the Divine (Complete Champion). It's rnd/level and you can end it early to get +10 ft per round of duration you give up. So at a CL of 50 and extended, it's 100 rounds = +1000 ft/round. On a Cleric/Barbarian (Champion of Gwyn-whatever?) with the Barbarian Ferocity variant, you would only need a CL of 26 +Extend to get +520 ft (enough for 550), which is achievable via minimal cheese with the right consumable magic items (Bead of Karma, and I think there's another from MIC that make this simple enough).

Charging with rapid wrath while moving at a downwards angle, net of x8 multiplier to speed. With a (Fly) speed of 70, you break your precious 550 ft.

[Kormoran]

Charging with rapid wrath while moving at a downwards angle, net of x8 multiplier to speed. With a (Fly) speed of 70, you break your precious 550 ft.

I hope I've memorized a quickened grease for this nice moment.

[EjoThims]

Extended High CL Footsteps of the Divine

Sad that persist no longer works.

[jojolagger]

Charging with rapid wrath while moving at a downwards angle, net of x8 multiplier to speed. With a (Fly) speed of 70, you break your precious 550 ft.

I hope I've memorized a quickened grease for this nice moment.

Because grease works so well on flying targets.

[KellKheraptis]

Extended High CL Footsteps of the Divine

Sad that persist no longer works.

It does if you're an Incantatrix

[EjoThims]

Extended High CL Footsteps of the Divine

Sad that persist no longer works.

It does if you're an Incantatrix

How does Incantatrix get around the errata again?

[KellKheraptis]

Extended High CL Footsteps of the Divine

Sad that persist no longer works.

It does if you're an Incantatrix

How does Incantatrix get around the errata again?

Metamagic Effect only checks to see if it's an ongoing magical effect.  Beyond that, apply whatever metamagic you want to it

[Bauglir]

But doesn't the feat have its own check?