Build Challenge

[Garryl]

You still need to have 5 caster levels to qualify for craft magic arms and armor. So earliest entry is after six, not using cheese, so that you both get the BAB +4 and the CL 5. Unless there's a full bab full casting base class that gets turning, then you could enter at six.

Practiced Spellcaster takes care of the CL in a non-cheesy way.

You don't get CL 5 until you have 5 HD, and you don't get a new feat until 6th. You'd need to pick a class that grants an appropriate bonus feat for your 5th character level. Marshal 1 would work, but that loses another point of BaB (and so only works with things like Dragonblood Cleric 9 or some full BaB class with turning).

[PhaedrusXY]

You still need to have 5 caster levels to qualify for craft magic arms and armor. So earliest entry is after six, not using cheese, so that you both get the BAB +4 and the CL 5. Unless there's a full bab full casting base class that gets turning, then you could enter at six.

Practiced Spellcaster takes care of the CL in a non-cheesy way.

You don't get CL 5 until you have 5 HD, and you don't get a new feat until 6th. You'd need to pick a class that grants an appropriate bonus feat for your 5th character level. Marshal 1 would work, but that loses another point of BaB (and so only works with things like Dragonblood Cleric 9 or some full BaB class with turning).

Hmm... yeah, it's a pain isn't it? Changeling Cleric 4/X1 (where X has full BAB) with Practiced Spellcaster. Take the Transformation domain for Alter Self. Turn into a human, and use your bonus feat for Craft Magic Arms and Armor. Take it for real as your 6th level feat, so you don't have to rely on that to qualify for the PrC anymore...

[JohnnyMayHymn]

These can be attained for entry at level 2

How?

Seems like BAB +4 requires at least level 4
Seems like Concentration 8 requires at least level 5 (assuming that's 8 ranks, and not a +8 bonus)

Not saying your wrong, I'd just like to see how to do it 

I was talking about a certain LN Psion with a candle of invocation, not something that I would normally suggest.  In this case it was to demonstrate the moot point of qualifying for a PrC if we don't know what it is, what it progresses, what role(s) it contributes to. 
Does the PrC have its own spell list? Does it progress casting?
We will be able to produce more appropriate builds if we know what the PrC/player/character wants the build to focus on.

[kitep]

Just the other day I saw a dwarf subrace that got craft magical arms and armor, craft wondrous item, and a few others as bonus racial feats.  Just can't find it right now 

midgard dwarf? something like that. I think that they have a huge LA adjustment.

That's it.  Frostburn, pg 124.  You're right about the LA.  +4.  And that's on top of the 8HD.  No help there.

[Jeriah]

What, pray tell, is this PrC you are aiming towards? Because at cleric 6, there's a lot of good you can do. Hell, there's a lot of good if you wanna go cleric 20 or PrC out starting at ecl 6.

Does the PrC have its own spell list? Does it progress casting?
We will be able to produce more appropriate builds if we know what the PrC/player/character wants the build to focus on.

The PrC is mostly self-contained and only advances Turn Undead, BAB, and saves, so it doesn't really matter what the classes are as long as they meet prereqs. I would really love to be able to take the class at 6th level if it's possible, though ToB is about the only thing banned.

The party role is mostly just to be filler, because the main party roles are already handled. I'm mostly just experimenting with builds and really want to get into this PrC as early as possible.

[kitep]

Needs a +1 CL boost (on something) to take Craft A&A early

Does this work?
And how long do you have to have the item?  Only for the "day" you qualify, or longer?
And can you use said item to qualify for the PRC at level 6, then use the level 6 feat to take Craft Magic Arms & Armor, and so have a self-supported build?

There's an item called the "Forge of Thautam" (Races of Stone, p 167)

Forge of Thautam: A dwarf using this forge can create
magic weapons and armor as if he had the Craft Magic Arms
and Armor feat.
Strong conjuration; CL 12th; Craft Wondrous Item, permanency,
creator must be a dwarf; Price 15,000 gp.

Does having this item mean he qualifies for the PrC?  Assuming he's a dwarf or can UMD it.

[Jeriah]

That's also well outside of wealth by level, and I'd really like to be able to qualify within that...

[Flay Crimsonwind]

Needs a +1 CL boost (on something) to take Craft A&A early

Does this work?
And how long do you have to have the item?  Only for the "day" you qualify, or longer?
And can you use said item to qualify for the PRC at level 6, then use the level 6 feat to take Craft Magic Arms & Armor, and so have a self-supported build?

There's an item called the "Forge of Thautam" (Races of Stone, p 167)

Forge of Thautam: A dwarf using this forge can create
magic weapons and armor as if he had the Craft Magic Arms
and Armor feat.
Strong conjuration; CL 12th; Craft Wondrous Item, permanency,
creator must be a dwarf; Price 15,000 gp.

Does having this item mean he qualifies for the PrC?  Assuming he's a dwarf or can UMD it.

The RAI is probably no, and RAW is no as well; it just says he can craft things as if he had the feat. It doesn't say anything like he would qualify as having the feat for a prc's prerequisites.

[JohnnyMayHymn]

Generic warrior from UA let's you pick turn/rebuke undead in lieu of a bonus feat, and pick custom skills, then a dip into cloistered cleric might a good direction to look...

EDIT: Duskblade 4, dread necromancer1(or cleric1)   meets everything except caster level 5 - to take craft magic arms and armor at 6th along with the first level of the PrC...
(I thought there was a feat that boosts cl, I either can't seem to find it or I am mistaken )

there is a two feat combo that gives you turn undead 1/day but it's in a dragon mag iirc this would allow Duskblade 5

[Emo_Duck]

Needs a +1 CL boost (on something) to take Craft A&A early

Does this work?
And how long do you have to have the item?  Only for the "day" you qualify, or longer?
And can you use said item to qualify for the PRC at level 6, then use the level 6 feat to take Craft Magic Arms & Armor, and so have a self-supported build?

There's an item called the "Forge of Thautam" (Races of Stone, p 167)

Forge of Thautam: A dwarf using this forge can create
magic weapons and armor as if he had the Craft Magic Arms
and Armor feat.
Strong conjuration; CL 12th; Craft Wondrous Item, permanency,
creator must be a dwarf; Price 15,000 gp.

Does having this item mean he qualifies for the PrC?  Assuming he's a dwarf or can UMD it.

I remember Terran Brandy (which is classified as a drug) in the Book of Vile Darkness that increases your caster level temporarily at the cost of ability damage.

Terran Brandy: A potent alcohol, this magical drink is favored by heartless spellcasters of all types. This green liquid is distilled from the essence of dying fey.
Initial Effect: +2 alchemical bonus to effective caster level for 1d20+20 minutes.
Secondary Effect: 2 points of Constitution damage.
Side Effects: None.
Overdose: If more than one dose is taken in a 8-hour period, the user immediately takes 1 point of Constitution damage.

The cost is 500 gp per dose.

[JohnnyMayHymn]

Duskblade 4 , Cleric1(or dread necromancer1)       take Practiced Spellcaster from complete divine

or Duskblade 5   and take god touched and divine channeler from dragon 305

[Jeriah]

Duskblade 4 , Cleric1(or dread necromancer1)       take Practiced Spellcaster from complete divine

or Duskblade 5   and take god touched and divine channeler from dragon 305

And I still can't pick up CMAA until 6th level, so that doesn't really do me any better than AlmostAnything 5 / Cleric 1. If I can't start the PrC at 6th level, then there's no real reason to jump through such hoops.

[Catty Nebulart]

Just the other day I saw a dwarf subrace that got craft magical arms and armor, craft wondrous item, and a few others as bonus racial feats.  Just can't find it right now 

I think you mean this midgard dwarf; http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=9557.msg409089#msg409089

The original monster is in 'it's cold outside' and has like +5 LA or something stupid like that.

If that is allowed you only need turn undead, so m-dwarf 1 and then 4 levels of cleric, or 4 m-dwarf levels and then one of cloistered cleric.

[zook1shoe]

Needs a +1 CL boost (on something) to take Craft A&A early

Does this work?
And how long do you have to have the item?  Only for the "day" you qualify, or longer?
And can you use said item to qualify for the PRC at level 6, then use the level 6 feat to take Craft Magic Arms & Armor, and so have a self-supported build?

There's an item called the "Forge of Thautam" (Races of Stone, p 167)

Forge of Thautam: A dwarf using this forge can create
magic weapons and armor as if he had the Craft Magic Arms
and Armor feat.
Strong conjuration; CL 12th; Craft Wondrous Item, permanency,
creator must be a dwarf; Price 15,000 gp.

Does having this item mean he qualifies for the PrC?  Assuming he's a dwarf or can UMD it.

I remember Terran Brandy (which is classified as a drug) in the Book of Vile Darkness that increases your caster level temporarily at the cost of ability damage.

Terran Brandy: A potent alcohol, this magical drink is favored by heartless spellcasters of all types. This green liquid is distilled from the essence of dying fey.
Initial Effect: +2 alchemical bonus to effective caster level for 1d20+20 minutes.
Secondary Effect: 2 points of Constitution damage.
Side Effects: None.
Overdose: If more than one dose is taken in a 8-hour period, the user immediately takes 1 point of Constitution damage.

The cost is 500 gp per dose.

But as soon as you lose the effects, you lose the feat and class

[Mixster]

Divine Minion Dragonwought kobold, 1st level is that cleric sub level, 2nd and 3rd are Master of Many forms, to get lesser dusk giant. Then eat yourself up to 5HD, and retrain your skills (possibly through psychic reformation).

So you can enter at level 3, if you are fond of Camembert.

[Jeriah]

There is no chance that my DM would let me take the 9th-level racial substitution at 1st level. That's just a silly interpretation of the rules and certainly not how it was ever intended to work.

[Ithamar]

Artificer gets CMA&A as a bonus feat at level 5.  He could persist Divine Power to meet the BAB pre-reqs, and Concentration is a class skill.  So really he just needs to get turn undead somehow...  Planar Touchstone perhaps?

[X-Codes]

There is no chance that my DM would let me take the 9th-level racial substitution at 1st level. That's just a silly interpretation of the rules and certainly not how it was ever intended to work.

It's not really silly, because that's how it's written.  I agree on the RAI, though.

Artificer gets CMA&A as a bonus feat at level 5.  He could persist Divine Power to meet the BAB pre-reqs, and Concentration is a class skill.  So really he just needs to get turn undead somehow...  Planar Touchstone perhaps?

If you're suggesting Sun Domain ability, just don't.  Sun Domain doesn't work the way many COers claim it does.

[Ithamar]

I know about the Sun Domain controversy, but depending on the DM it may or may not fly.  With a decent backstory, and the fact you're blowing a feat on it... *shrug*  Might be OK.

But surely there has to be some way for an artificer to nab turn undead?