[3.5] Malconvoker

[Bobikus]

Going to be starting up a 3.5e campaign with some friends this week, and was planning on trying Wizard for the first time.  After looking at a few prestiges and guides, Malconvoker looked fun.  Basically planning to make a build to go with getting as much use of Summon Monster at all levels, while being able to Planar Bind at higher levels.  The DM is allowing everything from the Core, Complete series, "Races of" series, any WotC supplement that isn't specific to a non-Greyhawk setting, and the Frank and K Tome Material.

So far, looking at something like this for a Human Wizard to start.

Focused Specialization (Conjuration), Necro, Evoc, haven't decided third school.
Rapid Summoning
Enhanced Summoning

4 Level 1 Feats (Class, Human, 2 Flaws)
Improved Initiative
Spell Focus(Conjuration)
Extend Spell
Metamagic School Focus(Conjuration)

Will probably take Master Specialist from 4-5, then take Malconvoker to at least 5.  Not sure where to go from there.  Basically looking for any general advice beyond what was stated in Treatmonk's handbook, specifically advice on helping to choose between Illusion and Enchantment for my third banned school.

Party will most likely be 4-6 players.  Only classes that I know are going to be played are the Tome Bard and Tome Fighter.

[Mixster]

Banning Illusion bars your access to spells that are hard to mimic. Transmutation has a few tricks that can give a Blur effect, but nothing that can give invisibility, or silent image until level 17.
Enchantment on other hand merely have a few Battle-Field control spells that Conjuration and Illusion also can do. And then a lot of things that work best on humanoids which can be done with diplomacy. So IMO I'd Enchantment of those two, unless it is a campaign with very little fighting or sneaking.

Barring Illusion also bars Silent Image which is an awesome spell.

Consider getting cloudy conjuration, from Complete Mage (I think), it gives you the option to get concealment when casting conjuration spells.

I don't have much to add on the Malconvoker thingie.

[Shiki]

I'd keep Illusion. It's a pretty versatile school, while Enchantment is kind of narrow, IMO.

From Complete Champion, Paragnostic Apostle 1, Knowledge Is Power: Call of Worlds; ain't bad.

Archmage 2-3, Mastery of Shaping, Spell-Like Ability for high level SMs, maybe Arcane Reach, or more SMs, etc.

Maybe consider skipping Enhanced Summoning for Martial Wizard. Take Improved Initiative with that 1st level bonus feat and take Augmented Summoning as normal. This means you still get a bonus feat at Wizard 5, which can be traded for Domain Granted Power(?) from Complete Champion. Travel Domain or Luck Domain powers aren't bad, though there might be others out there that are worth consideration.

Summon Elemental from Complete Mage can be quite useful for utility and as random flanker in combat.

Maybe Sculpt Spell as a rod or feat, Complete Arcane. etc...

'hope this can help. Can't think of more atm.

ps: http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5573.0

[Bobikus]

It doesn't look like I'd need Martial Wizard for improved initiative though, since it has no pre-req, and I can use my human bonus feat for Imp Init, although I guess it just matters on if I want to keep my feat slot open at 5 for Domain Granted Power.  Haven't decided yet if I'm going to go Master Spec at 4 though or wait.  Definitely going to take Paragnostic Apostle dip for Call of Worlds, but aside from that still pretty uncertain of what order or how many levels in each class.  Malconvoker 5+ of course, but not sure on too much beyond that, or if there's another PrC I'm not remembering.

[Akalsaris]

Well, presumably you're trading Scribe Scroll for Augment Summoning rather than Improved Init.

[vilenatas]

Invisible Spell is a dirty feat for this.

I would think about skipping Master Specialist so that you can get Spontaneous Divination for your 5th level wizard bonus.

You might consider also dipping into Paragnostic Apostle for +2 AC to Mage Armor style spells(inlcuding Mass Mage Armor or Chained Greater Mage Armor essentially adding full plate to your summons if you want) instead of Call of Worlds since the fast healing isn't really going to make much of a difference in most combats.

[Bobikus]

Hmm, in terms of Domain Granted Power, I did just notice the Summoner domain in CD that adds +2 to CL on summon/calling spells, although I'm not entirely sure how much of an impact CL really has in terms of those spells beyond duration.

[Ivory Knight]

Summoning Domain granted power might squeeze one more use out of Echoing Spell(which is awesome, if you can get your CL really high AND have pearls of power).
Without metamagic cost reducers, I'd stay away from Echoing Spell, but as Cheater of Mystra I used it to great effect.

I'd recommend 2 levels of Paragnostic Apostle, that way you can get both: Better Mage Armor & Fast Healing for your summons.

There is a way to get 1 Domain Power, even if you don't take the Wizard ACF: Planar Touchstone Feat(I keep forgetting, which touchstone it is exactly...)

[Echoes]

There is a way to get 1 Domain Power, even if you don't take the Wizard ACF: Planar Touchstone Feat(I keep forgetting, which touchstone it is exactly...)

Catalogues of Enlightenment. Do some paperwork, get divine power.

[Bobikus]

Is Thaumaturgist worth taking Arcane Disciple to get Planar Ally, even if I don't have the wisdom to actually cast it?

[Ivory Knight]

In my book: No, it isn't.

Wyrm Wizard(Dragon Magic) can get you this spell(or just about any other spell you might need).
There might be other ways, but this PrC is one of the easiest I know of: Just get a Dragon to tell you, how to cast a cleric spell with arcane magic

[The_Laughing_Man]

If you take Archmage, remember to strike out specialist spell slots for those nifty sla's and keep your general spell slots.

[Bobikus]

In my book: No, it isn't.

Wyrm Wizard(Dragon Magic) can get you this spell(or just about any other spell you might need).
There might be other ways, but this PrC is one of the easiest I know of: Just get a Dragon to tell you, how to cast a cleric spell with arcane magic

I don't think Wyrm Wizard though has casting progression on the levels that it gives spell research though, and I'm already losing a caster level from the first malconvoker level.

[Faithless tbe Wonder Boy]

Is Thaumaturgist worth taking Arcane Disciple to get Planar Ally, even if I don't have the wisdom to actually cast it?

In my opinion, Thaumaturgist is amazing for divine casters that don't get access to Contingency and don't want to Craft Contingent Spell for some reason, and for DMs that allow some flexibility with the choice of the planar cohort.  (The one Thaumaturgist I played allowed for a Nightmare cohort that advanced in levels as it went up, and that was pretty badass at level 12).  For arcane casters, I find the class less compelling.

Planar Binding is strictly better than Planar Ally in almost every practical way...

[Echoes]

Is Thaumaturgist worth taking Arcane Disciple to get Planar Ally, even if I don't have the wisdom to actually cast it?

In my opinion, Thaumaturgist is amazing for divine casters that don't get access to Contingency and don't want to Craft Contingent Spell for some reason, and for DMs that allow some flexibility with the choice of the planar cohort.  (The one Thaumaturgist I played allowed for a Nightmare cohort that advanced in levels as it went up, and that was pretty badass at level 12).  For arcane casters, I find the class less compelling.

Planar Binding is strictly better than Planar Ally in almost every practical way...

The main reason to take Thaumaturgist as a Malconvoker is for the free Augment Summoning, the auto-extended summons (which stacks with the Malconvoker's, giving you triple duration summons), and the contingent summon. The Planar Ally bonuses are just extra.

Still, unless you can find a painless way to get lesser planar ally (maybe have a naga make you an arcane scroll of it, if your DM doesn't beat you for asking?) I'd agree that overall it isn't worth it. While it's a power-up, it's mostly-unnecessary improvements to things you're already good at.

[Bobikus]

Also talked with the DM a bit, and I guess he plans on slowing the XP rate a bit so we'll be at the low levels for longer (starting at level 2).  This makes me a little more concerned about the opening Malconvoker level not having caster progression.

How does Malconvoker compare to other optimized Wizard builds in like the 5-13 level range?

[Gnorman]

Also talked with the DM a bit, and I guess he plans on slowing the XP rate a bit so we'll be at the low levels for longer (starting at level 2).  This makes me a little more concerned about the opening Malconvoker level not having caster progression.

How does Malconvoker compare to other optimized Wizard builds in like the 5-13 level range?

5-9, a bit behind, but it's not that horrible. Spontaneous casters have to deal with it all the time.

10 on (when Fiendish Legion comes into play), pretty damn well. That lost caster level is always going to be a bit of a bitch, but doubled summons bandage the wound fairly nicely.

[Faithless tbe Wonder Boy]

The main reason to take Thaumaturgist as a Malconvoker is for the free Augment Summoning, the auto-extended summons (which stacks with the Malconvoker's, giving you triple duration summons), and the contingent summon. The Planar Ally bonuses are just extra.

Still, unless you can find a painless way to get lesser planar ally (maybe have a naga make you an arcane scroll of it, if your DM doesn't beat you for asking?) I'd agree that overall it isn't worth it. While it's a power-up, it's mostly-unnecessary improvements to things you're already good at.

Right, that's sort of what I'm getting at.  Thaumaturgist's contingent summons is great for a divine caster, but for an arcane caster who can usually just straight-up cast Contingency, it's less compelling (although as most conjurers ban Evocation, and many DM's are less than cool with casting Contingency through Greater Shadow Evocation, it gets a little better).  By the time you can take Thaumaturgist, you probably have the Augment Summoning feat already.  Auto-extend stacks with the Malconvoker's, but I find the Malconvoker's extended summons usually last long enough already.

I'm not trashing the Thaumaturgist - I think it's an excellent class, and probably my favorite core PrC.  But again, your typical arcane Malconvoker is going to get less out of it than your typical cleric summoner.