Talking Shop: Taint

[Necrosnoop110]

What are your experiences and thoughts on the concept of using Taint? When should it be used? When not used? What are the larger effects of using this in a campaign? Any wise house rules or modifications?

Thanks,
Necro   

[altpersona]

would it bother you if someone gathered a massive amount of taint and suffered no ill effects?

[wotmaniac]

my experience is that the players have to be willing to buy-in to the concept, and have to be willing to accept DM interpretation.
This may seem like a no-brainer; but if you got anybody who prefers "subjective alignment", then you're gonna have problems.

otherwise, it can be kind of interesting .... all the way up until they get ready access to Heal, etc. (which is the same as with any party once they get the magic to easily get rid of stuff)

[RobbyPants]

Don't allow tainted sorcerers unless you want all kinds of RNG-Fuckery.  Other than that, it's a simple and interesting enough mechanic. 

Heroes of Horror made a more complicated version, half of which I like and half of which I don't.  The easiest way to keep the simplicity of the SRD/OA version with a bit more complexity is to split taint into to categories: corruption and depravity.  Have corruption only affect Con and depravity only affect Wis.  Physical things tend to cause corruption (tainted areas, undead creatures, etc), and depravity tends to be caused by fiends and depraved acts.  Also, you can redo certain monsters, so things like Alips inflict depravity instead of Wis drain.

[Necrosnoop110]

RNG-Fuckery.

[Garryl]

RNG-Fuckery.

You know, things like save DCs in the 40s by level 10, a dozen extra spell slots per level, things like that.

[PhaedrusXY]

RNG-Fuckery.

You know, things like save DCs in the 40s by level 10, a dozen extra spell slots per level, things like that.

RNG=random number generator (i.e., the d20).

Anything which makes any of your abilities so high that you're pretty much guaranteed success = RNG-fuckery. (Ridiculously high saving throw DCs on a caster, saving throws or attack rolls on any character, an untouchable AC, etc.)

A bunch of bonus spell-slots isn't specifically RNG-fuckery, but it could be used for that purpose.

[RobbyPants]

RNG-Fuckery.

Sorry about that.  Phaedrus explained it.

Basically, the normal save DC for a spell is 10 + spell level + ability mod.  Your ability mod is going to be ((ability score - 10 / 2) round down.  So, to get a base mod as high as  +10, you need a 30 in your stat.  To get a +20, you'd need a 50 in your stat.

The tainted sorcerer's DCs are 10 + spell level + taint score.  This score can be as high as double your Wisdom score -1.  Note, that this is your score, not your mod.  So, an average Wis caster (Wis 10) could have a taint score as high as 19 and still be walking around casting spells.  That's the equivalent of an Int or Cha of 48.  And this can get worse if you actually boost your Wisdom.

[Necrosnoop110]

would it bother you if someone gathered a massive amount of taint and suffered no ill effects?

Not sure, would need more context but I would ask what's the point of it if it has no "real" negatives?

[Tenebrus]

I'm a Lovecraft fan and have looked at taint as a mechanic.  You really have to use your DM powers to full effect to bring the drawbacks for taint.  Hopefully, you have good players who will run with "You hear voices telling you to kill that sniveling wizard with you" or won't freak out if you shrivel one of their arms for a high corruption score.  Make the casters roll (and roll well) to actually sleep at night without horrific nightmares; deny them the friendship of animals, including companions and possibly familiars, who are wigged out by the Elder Evil dripping from them.  Normal people will have nothing to do with people so profoundly "wrong," confounding their ability to get allies or jobs. 

Taint is supposed to be bad, but it's up to you to put teeth in the mechanics.  Don't roll on any chart; you know what to take away that will make it hurt any particular player.  Embracing taint means your player has decided to become a psychotic or a leper or both.

According to the rules, some spells can heal taint but you are of course not bound by that and can make taint a more profound corruption of the soul.  Maybe give the taint itself a saving throw.  And a player who hasn't cared about their growing evil and degeneracy should probably lose their access to higher level healing spells anyway.   

If this is taint for your BBEG, then you don't really need to care about the long-term.  The BBEG will only abuse the taint rules as much as you let him, and if it lets you build a flavorful gothic-style adventure, then go for it.

[RobbyPants]

would it bother you if someone gathered a massive amount of taint and suffered no ill effects?

Not sure, would need more context but I would ask what's the point of it if it has no "real" negatives?

That's why you don't use the Tainted Sorcerer.  The drawbacks become so minor that they're eclipsed by your net +10-15 on your DCs.

[awaken DM golem]

comic ... Lisa Lampanelli said:

"Jeff Ross ... you are a failure and you're nothing to look at ... looking at you it reminds me to shave my taint ! "

 

[Tenebrus]

comic ... Lisa Lampanelli said:

"Jeff Ross ... you are a failure and you're nothing to look at ... looking at you it reminds me to shave my taint ! "

 

Yep, it can be a bit hard to go through the taint rules and spells without giggling. 

[RobbyPants]

Especially the Heroes of Horror version, where there's a section called "Cleansing the Taint".

[graphic detail]Even worse, within days of me getting that book, we had a cat eat some chocolate and develop a case of the screaming shits.  We left her locked in a bathroom for a day until everything returned to normal.  When we brought her into the bathroom, her ass fur was soaked in shit.  The next day, she was all clean.  That made the whole "cleansing the taint" thing worse when you think about how cats clean themselves.

My wife decided it was easier to let her clean herself, and then brush her teeth! [/graphic detail]

[Necrosnoop110]

LINK: Sh$t Cat is Not Amused (warning fecal matter)